PART ONE: DISCUSS SIGNIFICANT SCENES AND CHARACTERS
Book Five begins with a meeting on Mount Olympus consisting of all the gods except for Poseidon. The purpose of this meeting is to discuss Odysseus’s fate. We already know that Poseidon has been very angry with Odysseus and it seems that he will not show him mercy. Even though Poseidon would have been adamantly against what the gods had to say about Odysseus, I find it naive that they did not include this powerful sea god in their discussion; they might have convinced Poseidon to let Odysseus go home and not to bother him anymore. However, I feel that Poseidon is somewhat stubborn, so his character would not have let Odysseus go home for any reason. With Poseidon or not, Zeus sends his son Hermes to Calypso in order to relay the message that Odysseus must be allowed to return home. Upon hearing this message, Calypso becomes defensive.
Q: Calypso accuses the gods of "double standards." What does she mean and do you agree with her? Why could it have been risky for Odysseus to reject Calypso's offer of immortality? How does he reject her offer diplomatically, and what does that show about Odysseus?
A: I believe Calypso jumped to conclusions too quickly. She probably seemed overwhelmed with Hermes visiting her and, at the same time, telling her that she must let go of her lover, Odysseus. This demand from Zeus angered her, resulting in her accusation of the gods having “double standards.” When goddesses have mortal lovers, like Demeter and Iasion for example, Zeus gets very angry. On the other hand, it is okay for gods to have mortal lovers. In this way, I agree with Calypso in that the gods are being sexist, but I think she went a little too far. Being in love with Odysseus, Calypso offered him the gift of immorality but he did not accept it. This could have been risky because Calypso can do much with her power and if she becomes frustrated or angry, that power can be used in a bad way. When Calypso asks Odysseus to become immortal, he answers in a cautious way; he compliments her beauty and tells her not to be mad at him. This answer reveals the wariness in his character and that he has a way with words. Odysseus seems like that person that fights for what he wants and doesn’t want things given to him without working for it.
Q: What should we make of the fact that Odysseus has spent all his days on Ogygia sobbing in anguish about how he wants to go home but spending all his nights there sleeping with Calypso in her cave. Homer says, "...he had no choice--unwilling lover alongside lover all too willing." How might he explain this to Penelope when and if he reaches home?
A: I feel like during the day Odysseus is faced with reality and knows he doesn’t belong on Ogygia but belongs back home. However, I feel like Calypso expects him to sleep with her because she saved his life and she needs something in return. Explaining the situation to Penelope when and if he reaches home, Odysseus might say that he did not want Calypso to become angry with him. If Calypso became angry with Odysseus, I feel like she would not tolerate his rebellion and she would make him suffer. For the sake of what life he had left in him, Odysseus at least obeyed Calypso’s desires.
Guiding Question #1: Imagine having the choice of becoming immortal; would you do it? How do you think becoming immortal would have helped Odysseus in his dire situation?
PART TWO: ILLUMINATE THE TEXT
1. Literary Devices:
· Irony- “…his clothing dragged him down – divine Calypso’s gifts…” (5.354). I think it is ironic that Calypso’s generosities almost made Odysseus drown. In the end, he actually takes off the clothes that were given to him by Calypso.
· Imagery- “Quickly under his feet he fastened the supple sandals, ever-glowing gold, that wing him over the waves and boundless earth with the rush of gusting winds” (5. 48-50). I feel that Homer does an excellent job by painting a picture through his words. This example of imagery helps me imagine Hermes getting ready to leave for this journey to Ogygia that is rarely taken by anyone. There is somewhat of a glamorous tone to it.
2. Epic Machinery:
· Epithets- The “nymph with lovely braids” relates to Calypso. In the beginning of Book Five, we are led to believe that Calypso’s home is more beautiful than anyone can imagine. Demeter, who made love to a mortal, is also said to have lovely braids. In this way, I feel like there is a correlation between lovely braids and goddesses falling in love with mortals. “The guide and the giant-killer” relates to Hermes. I think he is called “the guide” because Zeus sends him as a messenger on all missions. However, his “giant-killer” characteristic might come into play later in the story.
3. Topics from Introduction:
· Gods- In the introduction, it explains the relationship between gods and humans in The Odyssey. It is “a time when men were stronger, braver and more eloquent than they are now, women more beautiful, powerful and intelligent than they have been ever since, and gods so close to human life and so involved with human beings, in affection or in anger, that they are intervened in their lives and even appeared to them in person” (41). The fact that human beings were “better” makes me assume that that is why the gods were willing to be personally apart of their lives. Because the gods are very close to human beings, their main priority is to please the gods. This might support as to why Odysseus succumbed to Calypso’s commands and slept with her every night; he must foremost please the gods, no matter the situation.
· Hero: Throughout book five, I came to realize that Odysseus is more vulnerable and less enchanting than I thought he was. To let his feeling out, he wept a great deal. He also seemed to trust the gods much less than he should. When Calypso told Odysseus that she was finally going to set him free, he immediately questioned the validity in her statement; he could not believe it. He quickly assumed that she had another trick up her sleeve. This sense of mistrust is not a characteristic associated with a hero in the introduction. It says that Odysseus is a deceiver, but it seems that he is actually the one being deceived. The introduction also says that Odysseus is prideful. However, in the fifth book Odysseus seemed humble and helpless, which is far from being full of pride. I feel like these characteristics of Odysseus revealed to us in the fifth book will become more obsolete.
Guiding Question #2: Do you believe that Odysseus’s sense of mistrust will lead him in the wrong direction? Or will it only help him be more cautious and aware of his surroundings? Explain.
PART THREE: MAKE CONNECTIONS
One theme I found while reading the fifth book was loyalty. Athena showed loyalty to Odysseus by keeping him safe, especially at the end of the book when she rescued him from nearly drowning. She also stays loyal to Odysseus by standing up for him in front of all the gods, just like a loyal friend would do. To be loyal is to show faithfulness, and that is just what Athena does towards Odysseus. Odysseus is very dependent on Athena’s kindness and is willing to help him step by step along his journey. Athena would seem to be a great best friend. Another theme was revenge. Poseidon saw Odysseus traveling on the sea and became furious with the fact that the gods changed their minds without telling him. With that, he gave him much pain and trouble by making a storm on the vast sea. “Hope it Gives you Hell” by the All American Rejects is a song that has to do with revenge. The lyric “if you walk my way, hope it gives you hell” reminds me of Poseidon and getting in his way only leads to trouble. Another theme that came up was hospitality. When Hermes, went to Calypso’s home, he was awestruck by its beauty; he does not make this journey to Ogygia very often. And with his rare visits, Calypso still treats him with honor and respect. She tells him to tell her what’s on his mind and that “[she’s] eager to do it, whatever [she] can do…whatever can be done” (5.101-102). With that simple gesture of humility and serving Hermes with food and drink, I think Calypso is very hospitable. In the book, and movie, Pride and Prejudice takes hospitality very seriously. There is always something for the guest to eat and drink, even when their visit is a surprise. Guests are always put first before anyone else.
Guiding Question #3: How do you think these themes will play a part in the rest of the story? What other themes are represented in this book?
Guiding Question #3: How do you think these themes will play a part in the rest of the story? What other themes are represented in this book?
GQ1- I would choose to not be immortal if given the chance. I would not like to outlive everybody I love and will meet knowing that I would not die with them. If Odysseus chose immortality, I think that would have helped in the short term, but not the long term. It would help Odysseus cross the sea without fear of Posedion. His only worry about storms would be time, not being thrown into the cold water and possibly drowning. But, if he did become immortal, he would have to stay with Calypso.
ReplyDeleteGQ2- I believe that Oddyseus only mistrusted Calypso because she held him captive for years and always asked him to marry her. It was only reasonable for him to question anything that she offers to him. He may also mistrust the gods because Posedion is trying to kill him and Calypso is the daughter of a god. I believe that Odysseus is very trustful of humans, because he fought alongside so many brave men at Troy and needs to depend on hosts to shelter him and provide for his journey home.
GQ3- I think the themes of loyalty, revenge, and hospitality will be very frequent in the remainder of the story. Posedion is always trying to enact revenge on Odysseus by wrecking his ships and delaying his journey home. Also from the introduction, we know that when Odysseus arrives home, he takes revenge on all of his wife's suitors by killing them. Hospitality is very important also because the introduction had a large focus on it. In books 7-8, Odysseus becomes the guest of King Alcinous when he becomes shipwrecked on his island and his daughter the princess finds him. Odysseus is very loyal to his family because he is risking his life in war and his odyssey back to them. His son Telemachus also displays his loyalty to the family when he goes out trying to find him so the suitors will leave his mother alone.
1. If I were given a choice to be immortal, I would not choose that path. Being immortal would mean living forever and outliving your friends and family, and I do not want that to happen. At times I honestly wish I could stay this age I am forever because I have fun and can do whatever I want without adult responsibilities, but just like having too much of anything, I would definitely get sick of being 17. Especially if I couldn't die, being 17 would not be that fun after the 100th year. But if I was in Odysseus' position, I would highly consider being immortal because that would mean if I were to ever return home, I would not die from Poseidon's wrath. But, if I did oblige to Calypso's option of turning me (Odysseus) into an immortal, that would put me in the situation of also being with her forever and becoming dependent on her which would probably never lead to my return home. I think Odysseus knew these possible outcomes and did not consider her option of becoming immortal because he wanted to see his family at home as himself.
ReplyDelete2. Odysseus' sense of mistrust and danger will lead him to be more cautious on his voyage home because instead of his usual confident attitude when sailing out in the open sea, he will embark on this trip with a heightened sense of security which will benefit him in the end. It seems as if Odysseus has had many second chances to live (based off of all the books until book 8) and he seems to have realized that he should not take his luck for granted because out on the open sea, there is no way to know for sure if or when Poseidon will attack, and if any gods will be available to help Odysseus.
3. I agree with you about the two themes you listed about loyalty and revenge because revenge was shown earlier in the book when Aegisthus killed Agamemnon and then Agamemnon’s son, Orestes, killed Aegisthus. I feel like this theme of revenge will come up later in the book because Telemachus is searching for his father while keeping the suitors away, which wil lead to revenge either on Telemachus' part of the suitors'. The theme of loyalty has been shown continuously throughout the book each time Telemachus is at a new host's home and when Odysseus is at his host's place. I also believe this theme will continue to be revealed in the book because Telemachus is still carrying on his journey to find his father and bring him back home.
Part 1:
ReplyDeleteI think Calypso is a threat, if she can give immortality then she can take away mortality? Also, I this part made me think about how Odysseus is a very hard worker. On your blog where it says “When Calypso asks Odysseus to become immortal, he answers in a cautious way; he compliments her beauty and tells her not to be mad at him. This answer reveals the wariness in his character and that he has a way with words. Odysseus seems like that person that fights for what he wants and doesn’t want things given to him without working for it.” He is honest and is able to say something without offending anyone.
Part 2:
Epithets: Did “the lovely braids” separate the women who were in higher power from the middle class/poor? Since it’s a characteristic that plays a huge part on women, does it have anything to do with social status?
Gods: Since the gods have a higher power humans are suppose to look up to them, but how can people look up to Poseidon if he is trying to harm a king, Odysseus, who is only trying to go home?
Hero: I agree with you, I feel like Odysseus is vulnerable. He is losing trust little by little because he probably feels like he is being attacked by everyone; not only Poseidon but all the Gods.
If I was given a choice to become immortal I would do it. I love life as much as I love living. I wouldn’t have to worry about any dangers—I’d feel safer and powerful. But, I wouldn’t really want to live forever while everyone in my generation is gone.
I think immortality would help out Odysseus a lot. If Odysseus was immortal Poseidon can’t hurt him as much or have a chance of killing him. I think that would make Poseidon leave him alone because no harm will cross Odysseus. Yeah it still might take Odysseus to come home but at least he is safe—he would have less problems.
Trust isn’t given. You never know who is telling the truth or who is lying. And anyone can have a good or bad heart. I feel that Odysseus should be aware of his surroundings and be cautious. Since Poseidon wants him dead, I feel like Poseidon could of asked some townspeople to act polite to Odysseus and later on try to harm him. But, his mistrust may or may not lead him to the wrong direction. It was up to him if he wants to give out his trust to a stranger—but I think he shouldn’t because you never know who is real or fake.
Part 3:
Earlier I said trust wasn’t given easily, but I think loyalty is. If you are loyal to someone then you are trustworthy.
Raya, Great post overall. I especially like your observations in Part Two and your guiding question for that section. Your connections in Part Three are interesting, too.
ReplyDelete1. I would not choose to become immortal because I don’t have any reason to live forever. My family and friends will be gone but I would still be here, living by myself. Even if I make new friends, it will be weird since they will age with time, but I will be same no matter how much time has passed. But if I was in Odysseus’ position, I would have taken the offer. If Odysseus becomes immortal, then it means that he is standing next to all the gods. He would have far less trouble getting home and he doesn’t need to worry about getting killed (by Poseidon or others) before he reaches his home.
ReplyDelete2. Both are possible. It might lead him in the wrong direction because if he keeps questioning the gods, they might get upset and punish him. But it could also help him because being cautious is never a bad thing to do. Especially when he has many enemies (Poseidon and perhaps the suitors at his home), he should be careful about what others tell him. And I think Odysseus is not trusting Calypso because he lies to people and is assuming that others might lie to him (just like he deceives them).
3. I think these themes will be present throughout the story. The loyalty that Athena shows to both Odysseus and Telamachus is really strong and I don’t think Athena will ever turn against them. I think revenge will play a greater part when Odysseus comes home because in the introduction we read about how he gets really angry at the suitors who besieged his wife and kills them. Lastly, I think hospitality will definitely play a big role throughout the story. We have already seen how the hosts treat their guest with great pleasure but at the same time, it is ironic because all the hosts but Odysseus’ family treats the guests well (I understand that the suitors at his place are rude but shouldn’t Telamachus and Penelope treat them better?).
Guiding Question #1: If I had the choice of becoming immortal, I do not believe I would. I think it would be really difficult to never die because you could pass by all your loved ones and not spend your life with them. I also believe that Odysseus becoming immortal would not help him in his situation. In the beginning of book five, Athena tells Zeus that Calypso “holds him there by force. He has no way to voyage home to his own native land, no trim ships in reach, no crew to ply the oars and send him scudding over the sea’s broad back” (5.16-19). This shows that without Calypso’s cooperation, there is no way for Odysseus to return home safely. But, if Odysseus chose to become immortal, he would have no way to return home anyways. Calypso said she would make him immortal if, and only if, he stayed there with her. This obviously would not help him with his situation because although he would be immortal, he would still be unable to return home.
ReplyDeleteGuiding Question #2: I do not believe that Odysseus’ sense of mistrust will lead him in the wrong direction, but it could. Since he has a sense of mistrust, it might help him be more cautious and aware of what is going on around him. This is sometimes a good thing, because one can never be too careful if they are not sure who is telling the actual truth. But, in one instance in book five, Odysseus’ sense of mistrust could have gotten him killed. While Odysseus was fighting the waves of the sea, a woman named Ino decided to help him. When she offered Odysseus advice, he said, “I fear another immortal weaves a snare to trap me, urging me to abandon ship! I won’t. Not yet” (5.393-394). He did not listen to Ino at first, and was thrown from his ship. But then he took her advice, which ultimately saved his life. Having this sense of mistrust could be a problem in the end for Odysseus, because most of the people he has encountered so far have tried to help him.
Guiding Question #3: I believe loyalty will continue to play a part in the rest of the story because so far, Athena has not steered Odysseus or Telemachus in the wrong direction. Athena comes into the story as soon as trouble encounters Odysseus and she always helps him through whatever trouble he is in. I do not believe she will always win his fights or help him through them, but she continues to try and that shows loyalty on her part. Revenge, I believe, is another theme that will continue to play a part in this story. Many of the gods and kings seek revenge because of the wars, and throughout Odysseus’ journey, more and more people are going to play a role in continuing some kind of war.
If I had the chance to become immortal I don't think I would be able to take it, unless my loved ones were made immortal with me. I wouldn't be able to stand the pain of watching my loved ones pass and endure the misery of living alone. As for Odysseus, I truly believe he made the right decision. He did not want to be immortal for he did not want to lay with Calypso for eternity. Odysseus' goal was to get home to his wife and son, and would not compromise for that.
ReplyDeleteObviously Odysseus is going to be cautious, but that can only help him on his journey full of deceit. It is the smartest thing for him to do to play it safe, because he can not risk getting caught up for a few more years on an island, delaying him from his goal. If Odysseus wants to make it home as quickly as he can, he might take some risks, but after everything he has seen, he just wants to make it home soon and alive. It is the right choice for him to e cautious.
Loyalty has to play a major role for the rest of the book for it was such an important role for their society. Loyalty to your kings, loyalty to your guests, and of course loyalty to the gods. With this in mind The Odyssey is bound to continue to be about loyalty in many ways. Maybe Odysseus will not pay his respects to the gods one day and be thrown further off course?
Book 5
ReplyDeleteGQ1 – If I was in Odysseus’ situation I would definitely not take the offer of immortality. Odysseus obviously hated being stuck on Calypso’s island, because all he did every day was sob for the life that he had lost. He was ashamed that he missed out on the opportunity to die at Troy, because then he could have at least died with honor. I don’t think becoming immortal would have helped Odysseus, because if he had accepted Calypso’s offer, she probably would have made him stay on her island for all eternity. One thing that confused me, though, is when Odysseus was about to leave and he had sex with Calypso one last time and he seemed to like it and felt sad for leaving her. Why was he sad to leave if he actually had feelings for her (were those feelings only there because of her “spells?”).
GQ2 – I think it is a good thing that Odysseus isn’t so sure about trusting the gods/spirits right away. They have obviously been manipulating him for 20 years (Calypso spent pretty much the whole seven years that Odysseus was on her island trying to seduce him and convince him to stay with her forever), so it’s probably not the best idea to blindly follow anything that they say. Some of the gods might get angry that he doesn’t follow their every word, but ultimately he is better off for doing what his gut instinct tells him. Most of the time his gut tells him to do what the gods say, but when their guidance seems wrong, he should do what he believes is right.
GQ3 – I don’t think the hospitality is going to end any time soon in this story. From what I can tell, following the rules of hospitality seems to be one of the most important things for a person to do in this culture. I’m interested to hear about Odysseus’ story to see all of the other examples of hospitality, because it is the thing about this play that has fascinated me more than anything else.
If I had the opportunity to immortalize myself I would be torn with my decision. Of course I would like to be forever young, do everything and anything because I have all the time in the world. But like Spiderman’s grandpa said, “With great power, comes great responsibility.” I would have to watch everyone around me die and suffer through age while I sit ageless safe and sound. Each day would be the same, I wake up do what ever I want. I would have to move a lot to hide the fact of my agelessness. I would have to lie to the people I love, leave them, and never see them again. In the end I think there are more consequences of being immortal than there is good.
ReplyDeleteIn Odysseus’ case it would be the worst decision of his life if he chose to be immortal under Calypso’s will. Odysseus was held captive for seven years and through out it chose not to be immortal. He hated and dreaded every minute he spent with Calypso because all he wanted to do was return home. If he became immortal, he would never be able to escape Calypso he would live forever. I believe his motivation for rejecting Calypso’s offer of immortality is the hope that one day he will escape, even by death.
Raya, I have to disagree with your opinion on your Topics from Introductions: Gods. You say that because the humans are getting “better” the gods are personally being a part of their lives and that it is a good thing for the humans. Personally I agree with you saying that the humans are getting “better” but this is bad for the humans. Because the humans are now better and are being compared to the gods, the gods are becoming furious. They do not want the humans to be like them or be compared to them because they want to be superior and keep their powers. With that said, the god’s take part in the human life so the humans watch their step and actions. Any wrong move will upset a god and your life will be over. For example, Odysseus.
GQ1: If I was in Odysseus' place I would not want to become immortal. He doesn't like being stuck with Calypso so why would he chose to put himself in a position where he would be able to stay with her forever. Plus all of his loved ones and friends would die, while he lives and lives. I don't think it would help his situation in any way. It would only make it worse because it would prolong his being in a place he doesn't want to be.
ReplyDeleteGQ2: I think his sense of mistrust can be like a double-edged sword. Like when Ino first helped him, he was skeptical and almost didn't accept her help. He would have died if he hadn't taken her help. But at the same time he has reason to not trust people because he is a liar. So he might think people are more like him then they lead on to be. This only adds to his mistrusting of people. I think in the long run it will help him but only if he knows when to trust people.
GQ3: I think hospitality, loyalty, and revenge will continue to be the biggest themes in the book. They each have come up so may time within only five books of the whole story. I think we will see more from Poseidon in terms of getting revenge on Odysseus for killing his son. People will be hosting Odysseus as he makes his way home, and Athena will continue to stick up for and help Telemachus and Odysseus.
Before I respond to any questions, I just wanted to point out that Hermes is the “ giant killer” because he murdered the giant Argos because he was preventing Zeus from continuing one of his many affairs, part of the double standards of the gods.
ReplyDeleteAnyway, Calypso wouldn’t do anything to harm Odysseus. Odysseus is the catch of the day. He has an overwhelming amount of charisma that draws everyone around him to him. Unfortunately, he has so attracted Calypso that she can’t bear to be without him. She won’t ever harm him, but she won’t share him either. However, immortality is a strange concept. I don’t think I could ever chose immortality, I’d hate having to find a new bunch of friends every so often because the old group died or got old. Just doesn’t seem like fun. Even if Odysseus was destined to stay on the island, I am not sure immortality would have been his choice anyway.
His mistrust won’t necessarily make things harder or easier, just more interesting, possibly dysfunctional. As we can see with his interaction with the gods after leaving Calypso’s island, he mistrusts the gods, but still obeys them. I think he is slowly gaining faith back in the gods, except for Poseidon, for obvious reasons.
As for themes, as Odysseus retells his story, I believe we will come over all of his plights. Most of these will originate from Poseidon or at least involve the sea which I believe is Poseidon’s domain. However, Troy was one of Poseidon’s city states, so is most likely fuming over the sacking of Troy before Odysseus blinds the Cyclops.
From what we’ve been taught in class I also think you are right in your assumption that hospitality will continue. Maybe not for the rest of Odysseus’s tale, but almost certainly for the later part of his return home and the rest of Telemachussus’s story.
1. Without a doubt, I would never want to be immortal. Ever since I read the book Tuck Everlasting, I have just always felt like it would be horrible to be stuck at a certain age when you see everyone around you living normally and experiencing different stages of life. It seems so amazing when you think about it at first, but after consideration, it would be so hard to get attached to people and form ordinary relationships. I agree with Esther completely when she talks about how being a teenager is so much fun, but it was be ridiculous if I stayed a teenager forever. The future does scare me, but being immortal would sort of be like taking the easy way out because I know I would go through so many ups and downs when I am older. However, in the case of Odysseus, I feel that if I was in his situation, I am not sure what I would do in regards to a never-ending life because I would perpetually be in the presence of Calypso. I would never be able to be back with my family, but I would also never have to worry about Poseidon.
ReplyDelete3. I do feel that the theme of envy and revenge are present a lot in the book. The most prime example of revenge is when the suitors start taking over Telemachus’s palace and Telemachus became furious because his mother was obviously being affected by it. That is a main reason why Telemachus wants to find his dad, because he doesn’t want anyone taking the place of his father. In addition, the gods and leaders still seek vengeance because of the wars and battles they have been through. Another theme that seems to be in the book a lot is faithfulness and devotion. Athena and Telemachus show devotion to each other. Also, Telemachus is risking his life and going through a lot on his journey to find Odysseus and bring him back, so he is clearly very faithful. I do suspect that these themes will be present for the rest of the book, because Telemachus still has a long voyage ahead, and there will most likely still be perils and dangers ahead.